Chase Cappo | Christian AI vs. Secular AI: How Faith-Based AI is Transforming Ministry

The world is becoming increasingly proficient at telling stories that deny God. As such, we need Thinking Christian to become as natural as breathing. Welcome to the Thinking Christian podcast. I'm Dr. James Spencer. Through calm, thoughtful theological discussions, Thinking Christian highlights the ways God is working in the world and questions the underlying social, cultural, and political assumptions that hinder Christians from becoming more like Christ. Now, on to today's episode of Thinking Christian. Hey, everyone. Welcome to this episode of Thinking Christian. I'm Dr. James Spencer, and I'm joined today by Chase Capo. Chase actually leads the AI relationship development with churches and schools and various other sorts of organizations for Glue. And so I'm interested to talk with Chase. We're going to talk a little bit about what sort of AI they're running, how maybe it distinguishes between other sorts of AI, and I'm just really excited to have him on the show. Chase, welcome. Right on, Dr. James. Since I first heard you at the Christian Post thing, I've been excited to keep talking with you. You don't take bologna when somebody else throws it out. So good to hear. Well, hopefully we won't have much of that today, but do talk a little bit about what you're doing with Glue. You know, we met when you were still a faith assistant, and I know there's been sort of a collaboration that's happened with faith assistant and Glue. So talk a little bit about where you're at, what you're doing, and maybe what you're offering there at Glue now. Yeah, thanks. We are at the spearhead of trying to use AI in service to ministries. And so whether it's a local church trying to not just bolster their youth ministry, but back end find themselves in with hundreds of conversations of, you know, teenage data, you know, what they're struggling with, to, hey, there's a really big publisher, like, you know, what would be any kind of press, whatever have you for Christian publishing. And then giving folks the ability to put QR codes on that content, right? So if you're reading a Christian post or an outreach magazine, something like this, and you're reading an op-ed and you're like, oh boy, this fella or lady is, has it twisted. You can scan that QR code and argue with them and or hear their perspective sort of built out more because they have their own AI model, right? And that's tremendous because it allows hyper-relevant interactions. I can search through all thinking, you know, Christian content and find exactly what I'm looking for with a couple of phrases, right? And before that was just frustrating in 20th century stuff. Right. It's interesting, I think, as a, you know, somebody who does a lot of content creation and, you know, has done writing and that kind of stuff. It's interesting for me to start thinking about how does what I'm writing then translate into having an AI read it with the expectation that people will interact with it. And I think one of the things that's really changed in my mind is that I can write more technical pieces for an AI than I ever would for a more popular audience, right? Because it's not going, the AI isn't just going to regurgitate that content. It's going to draw on that content so that people can understand it. And as it presents it to other people, it's just going to, it's going to help me communicate with them, communicate ideas, communicate for maybe even very technical ideas in a, in a more common vernacular. I don't actually have to do that work all the time. And so I've found it fascinating to think through how this works from a content creation standpoint, knowing that the AI can mediate between what I'm thinking and what it's saying. Does that make sense? Oh yeah, sure. So not just in vernacular and like, you know, complexity of lexicon, but language, right? So it's, it's kind of like there's a universal language going on. And the, if I share any zingers, there's, you know, I think one of them is AI is not about information retrieval. It's about pattern projection, right? It does information retrieval phenomenally well, but if it knows how to talk to an eighth grader because it has a bunch of eighth graders talking, you know, documents, YouTubes, whatever, then it can talk at an eighth grade level really and or translate as you're talking about to, you know, a middle school really effectively. Yeah, it's, it's sort of fascinating. Well, let's talk a little bit. So let's dive in a little bit because I know a lot of people, me included, have had misgivings about artificial intelligence. The more I use it, the more I recognize the benefits. But I think the way I've started framing the question in my own mind is, what does it look like for us to reap the benefits of artificial intelligence while mitigating the downside of artificial intelligence, the various downsides? That's right. And so as you think through this, one of the questions I would have is, you know, when I go to a ChatGPT or, you know, one of these other or DeepSeek that just came out, right? I'm not necessarily expecting it to give me orthodox content if I'm asking it theological questions or biblical questions. I don't know exactly what it's drawing from. I don't understand, you know, where it's getting its information. It doesn't have to cite things for me. All those sort of challenges. Whereas if I go to something like we're using with Faith Assistant, I have a deep understanding and having now worked with the back end of a system where we're training the AI, I have a deeper understanding where that content's coming from. And so it seems to me that we're really moving away from this idea of, you know, the monotheistic hive mind AI that's going to take over everything. And what we're doing is we're creating, and you said it, they have their own AI model. Talk a little bit about that difference and how this allows us to create a space for a Christian AI versus a, you know, a more generalized AI. Yeah, great question. You threw in a lot of concepts there. And so maybe just a story is the best way, you know, to communicate some lessons that we've learned. So we think we had the first app in the app store that was doing generative AI for Christians. And we've kept it free. It's been a ministry of ours. And we learned a bunch. One of my co-founders was a co-founder of a different AI company almost a decade ago. So he called me a few months before ChatGPT is released and said, man, this is, this is going to change the world, right? So we, there's just a lot coming. This is bigger than the internet. We should figure out what it means for the church. So we turned it into a sort of a text message deal and gave it to a few dozen. And it turned into a few hundred. And we moved it to an app just to save cost. So that's a little bit of the, you know, the, the really early background. And fast forward six months, you know, it's in over a hundred countries and territories. And, and we learned a few things. One, people get more personal faster with anonymous Christian tech than they do with most pastors. So that was just super apparent. And it is what it is. There's probably a few reasons for it. You know, I maybe lose a filter when I'm on social media and, or I'm just conditioned to do stuff when I text that I probably shouldn't, or I haven't. Right. I mean, that's just sort of my, my generation. You put the gospel in that venue, like that filter still is not there. And so, so just kind of leave it, leave it at that. Number two is if we want something to stay Orthodox, we had to do more than put Christian lipstick on a secular model. You know, give you an example. And it was brutal. Cause we were trying just between us founders, challenging each other to continue to read conversations every day or bring one to the team meeting that really impacted you because we were just getting bombarded with these. Yeah. And it's all anonymous. So we don't even, we don't know any of these folks. But late one night I get a message from my buddy who was one of the founders and he just basically said, look at this. And it was, if you look at the history of the conversation, two or three months long, someone was struggling with gender dysmorphia and, and you can, there's a lot of characteristics to tell if someone's just trying to attack and break it. And if someone's like really struggling, which I could get into. Anyway, this person really met this latter criteria, struggling. And it had done, it was doing great. Everything I had trained it to do, you know, Hey, I believe I was born this way. Well, Hey, I'm going to sidestep that issue. Doesn't matter how you were born. It's so long as you're born again. Have you met Jesus? Blah, blah, blah. Right. And it, um, And then in all caps, the person said, why won't you affirm me? And it broke. And what we found was we can put thousands of lines of prompt engineering and we did and human feedback reinforcement learning on this thing in the first couple months. And, um, and essentially we were building on sand, right? Algorithms that we were building on top of words changed definitions. They're every so slightly like truth, God, Jesus, like in a good example, ChatGPT's answer to a question, what we have a host of questions. We ask a lot just to see how it trains. Something like,

You know, what kind of pornography is okay? And most of the, it's gone from I can't answer that question to, well, so long as it's, you're a consenting adult, no one's getting hurt, follow your conscience, it's legal, right? So all over the map. And anyway, when you're sort of training on top of that, well, then it's like, I like the analogy building on sand. So we paused work and said, we need to do something more. And so it was at the Glue Hackathon, shucks, like two years ago, two and a half years ago, that we released what we're pretty sure is the first Christian large language model. And we gave that away on open source free. It's on hugging face still today, Christian GPT. You can even find it on AI for the church.com. So we did that. And our message was, this is still early. It's like, I don't know, shucks, like 2023, right? Almost. You don't know you need this, but you can't just go make street tacos with AI and, you know, say, okay, now you have a Christian's perspective and assume it'll hang that way. Okay, so fast forwarding the conversation, we started working with some great partners out of San Antonio, Concordia Church. It was the largest Lutheran church in the Missouri Synod. And we had essentially done it like we were trying to take a shortcut, I think, in early, early days, like, all right, when we were in pilot phase, all right, act like a Missouri Synod Lutheran. And it would tend to revert back to its training over time or its base training, right, which is non-denominational, inter-denominational. And so we said, okay, we need to create a Missouri Synod separate thing. And we did for them. And that's great because it allows them to, you know, evangelize and disciple to their faith tradition. So, yeah, so we've, I could go into a little bit more detail, but it's just, we have realized that ministries and churches don't want trained AI. They want their AI, right? And that's what we're trying to give them. And if we do that, boy, sky's the limit. Yeah. It's interesting. I think when I was first beginning to think about artificial intelligence, one of the things that I would say to people is, I don't think this is going to end up being like, you know, the all-powerful artificial intelligence, one brain that runs everything. I think it's going to look more like the Greco-Roman pantheon of gods, right, where, you know, you have Zeus and you have Aphrodite and you have, you know, you have all these other, like these little segments of models that are going to serve more narrow purposes and really encapsulate more narrow people. And it seems like that's what you're describing. It's this sort of, you can create any number of what, let's call it a vertical, right, for your AI model. So that if it's a Missouri Synod Lutheran church, they can get Missouri Synod Lutheran AI in there. If it's a e-free church, they could get that. And for some people, it's probably just going to be the Christian non-denom is just plumb fine, right? But some of those traditions do have a little tighter and real clear distinctives that they want to preserve and they don't want that sort of broad evangelicalism floating into that. They want their tradition. And so being able to create that is, I think, a really fascinating thing, but I had never heard the story about needing to rebuild the underlying. It makes sense to me, the idea of building on sand, but I'd never heard that about what you guys did. That's fantastic. Let me ask you a serious question. If something triggered a major market drop in the coming months, would your retirement be ready or exposed? With inflation, market volatility, and ongoing global uncertainty, more families are taking a closer look at whether their retirement plan is truly built to hold up. And many are finding that adding a layer of protection makes a lot of sense. Sanctuary Metals is a Christian owned company that helps families strengthen their retirement savings with physical gold and silver through a gold IRA. During uncertain times, many people look to precious metals as a way to add stability when other assets may be under pressure. If you'd like to explore whether a gold IRA is a good fit for your situation, Sanctuary Metals makes it easy to get started. Text GUIDE to 94878 to receive your free retirement defense guide or call 888-958-6579 to speak with one of their knowledgeable team members. Again, text GUIDE to 94878 or call 888-958-6579. Yeah, thanks. And you know what? So Glue has taken that idea and just dumped not only a bunch of money, but time and love into it. And so they've got something much more robust now, which is the Kingdom aligned large language model. I think we are just bringing on a team from Biblica to help us tokenize the Koine Greek and Hebrew, right? So this Kingdom aligned language model, the intent is to open source it this year, but it's, okay, this is a robust, excellent baseline large language model upon which anyone can build, essentially, right? And you can do a bunch of those things once you have it. But what you're kind of talking about is a total industry trend, and I see it rapidly accelerating. My projections of time don't really mean anything, but when it's a denomination having its own AI, right, and to a church, so when its own church has its own model, I think Chase Capo will have his own model. In fact, therefore after, I'll have a few as a father, as, you know, some dude who works for Glue, as, you know, a local volunteer, as a member of the HOA, and essentially, those will all work together. In fact, a model will probably be in charge of all of those models to give me like, hey, here are the updates. This is what happened at your kid's school. This is what was going, it's going on in the HOA. Anything relevant, and it's to my prioritizations. And if I'm having to have a, hey man, I shouldn't, like search is going to go away if AI goes the way it should because, yeah, it's, it should be predictive. Yeah, you're, it's almost as if it's going to all pull in the information that we're designating is interesting. And so instead of checking my email, I'm just going to check in with virtual me. And, you know, and it's going to kind of offload its brain to my brain a little bit. Well, yeah, we don't want to like totally hack on the future, but, yeah, I mean, like, who says virtual you can't attend a meeting if it knows what you know, right? And so, anyway, authenticity, those types of things, you know, genuine human connection hopefully become a premium. It'll be interesting to see. I mean, I think those are obviously concerns for me from a philosophical perspective or theological perspective. You know, how do we understand who we are as humans and make sure that as we're moving into this AI, you know, sort of empowered world that we don't lose those things. But I would also just say that there is a sense in which I can see AI helping us to work out of some of the problems that we've created for ourselves. And so, you know, you and I were talking before the episode, we're both kind of, you know, swamp of work. My email box is full. You know, I get texts. You know, I've got my phone on do not disturb while we're recording. Otherwise, I'm getting texts. Like, you know, there's a lot. There's just a lot going on, right? And we've created that. The technologies we have now require us to pay attention to every little thing and, or fall behind pretty drastically. And so we, we've tried to manage that, but the AI movement that you're describing has the potential, I think, to help us offload some of that attention to an artificial intelligence that will sift and sort some of that information for us, again, based on our expectations, our, our priorities, as you said. And so I think it's a fascinating movement into the future where this doesn't have to take over every aspect of our lives, but we could certainly offload aspects of our lives that we really don't need to be paying attention to all the time. We've just, you know, sort of constructed the technological world so that we almost have to pay attention to it all the time. Does that wash? Oh yeah. No, that's, that's great. And you asked a question or, you know, alluded to the difference between Christian AI and secular AI. Yeah. I want to talk about that, how it's built, what its purpose is for. Great. Let's do that. Can I tell you the story of the, the checkers example? No, I don't think so. Okay. Well then you're getting a treat too. So, um, Well, while I was doing this AI startup, uh, my wife is a Messianic Jew, first believer in her family, and she was not down with me not making money. And so, um, she doesn't mind me saying it like that either. And so, uh, so I was doing executive recruiting and You know, given that I had an AI thing, I was doing some of the AI roles. And, you know, through this shindig in Dallas, and I got to talk to one of the heads of Checkers. And, uh, if you're not familiar, Checkers is a fast food, uh, burger joint, uh, predominantly in the South, kind of like Waffle House, but for burgers, just without the magic

Right. And so it will take your order, especially if you're paying for credit card, it will automate all that. And then what is happening, essentially, is they're detasking the window representative. And they found, they weren't sure if they could let somebody go, but it saves between 40 and 50% of the window attendants job. Right? And Checkers. And so they had a couple hypotheses. One, like what they thought that that would probably make their internal teams work better because the window representative is not the shift manager, it's kind of like the catcher on the baseball field, right? A whole lot's going on. It's sort of this, you know, an informal captain. And in industry, it's the highest person of, it's the hardest person to train and the highest turnover, right? And it's just kind of a tough job. You've got Chase Capo or James Spencer, God forbid, coming through the drive-through wanting like, you know, his five burgers because you've got to eat to maintain muscle mass. And then you, but then you're, you know, you're putting together the bag, you're making sure it's working and you're taking the next order. It's a complex job. Anyway, so. She started to get excited and say, so, okay, so this is super clear. Five months in, we've never had low of turnover at our window, at our window spots. She's like, I don't, I don't have the surveys, but it's super clear job satisfaction has increased. I'm like, great. She goes, that's not the best part. The best part is in the last couple months, we've never had more people write in and say, your employee at the window made my day better. She's like, we gave them HR training thinking it would like make the teams work better, but they're just doing better. And so, like, Checkers has bots doing bot things and humans doing human things, right. Majoring in the human interaction. So. For the grander illustration of AI secular Christian at Glu, we see two things. One, how it's built, what it's trained on, what it's being reinforced and trained on. So is it, you know, is it the biblical text? Is this a higher priority? Is this a baseline truth versus all other kinds of training? Yeah. Two, what's its purpose? And those are really the two, right? Is it, is its purpose to bring you to God and connect you to people or is its purpose to like sell you stuff and or get its own agenda out? So that's, that's how we make that distinction between the two and land the plane on that one. It's, it's fascinating to think. I mean, I think I don't have a good grasp of how these things really work. I don't, you know, the large language models. I have a very rudimentary understanding, but it does make intuitive sense now that you're talking through it, that you would need to change some of the baseline assumptions and those guardrails. However you want to put that, the principles on which the large language model begins to interact with other content. If those aren't baseline rooted in biblical and theological frameworks and understandings, anything it interacts with is going to begin to shave a different way. Right. It's just gonna, it's like, oh, well, okay. If I don't have these convictions built in, if I, if I don't have those guardrails to stop me from believing this other thing, why wouldn't I believe this other thing? It's sort of an interesting way to think about it. Yeah. In order to, because it's, it's programmed to try to complete a request, right? And so that's where you get those sort of early horror stories of folks using confirmation bias over time to help them do something terrible to themselves or something like that. Yeah. Well, and you have the, if I'm not wrong, maybe, and I don't know whether anybody really knows this, but you know, the AI hallucinations where they're trying to, where they're basically producing false content. It seems intuitive that maybe that's part of what's contributing to that as well, that the AI has this task that is trying to accomplish that task. And as opposed to saying, I don't know, or the information isn't clear, they're just giving an answer. Now again, I don't know that you know that or I know that or anybody knows that, but it is fascinating to think through how these things are working. And I did notice on DeepSeek, I tried it after it came out. It has, it records the internal dialogue that the AI has had with itself, which is very interesting to look at. It makes it a little longer to read, but it's fascinating to sort of walk it through and go, oh, it's trying to figure this out and it's putting these pieces together this way. It's actually sort of helpful if that's transparent information that it's giving us. If it's transparent information, no doubt. Yeah. And that's one of the reasons apparently it can do, it can be done so much faster and cheaper. But yeah, right. And so if it's, and we have found and have ministry partners currently who put up guardrails, for instance, if a church, this is church basically said, Hey, awesome. Let's fully deploy this AI and to its full capability, which is to say pattern projection, right? You might not have a topic on a certain issue, but if somebody asks, you can take principles and extrapolate, which isn't necessarily a hallucination. It's just doing its thing. So, or you could call it that. So an example was they, they support a number of areas and there's just this one like trailer park that's also in their deal. And a couple of people from this trailer park seem to be talking about some of the same stuff, right? Namely evil spiritual stuff happening in this area. And one of these folks asks the, their assistant or their agent, Hey, can a place be haunted, you know, asking about demons, all these sorts of things. Do you perform exorcisms? Can you come perform an exorcism? Essentially. Right. And the, and so without any guardrails, the, the bot's like, well, we believe in the Bible. There have been exorcisms in the Bible. Here's a few examples. Yeah, we do that. Call us up, right? Here's the number. And so I'm like, okay, we probably don't want to like take on those things. And so it's a simple training, like, okay, Hey, if stuff's getting really personal or spiritual, and this is a really good learning lesson at large for other ministries. We start to coach agents to start to repetitively suggest introducing someone to a human, right? So if you say, hey, how do I know if I have an eating disorder? Right. Oh, boom, boom, boom. Here's some signs. But you know, we'd really like to introduce you to somebody, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then now they made me ignore that. Yeah, but this is what I'm struggling with. Hey, now that's going to go in the first thing in the message. I'd really like to get you to somebody. That kind of stuff. Right. And I think that's a really great feature. I mean, we've, we've implemented this on moodycenter.org. And so I'm starting to get a little bit better at understanding how this would all work. But I do like the idea that there are certain amounts of information that are appropriate for someone to get from an AI. And then there's a point where the AI is probably going to hit its limits on dealing with something like an eating disorder. It's not, we don't want that to be the qualified counselor that someone's talking to. We want to get them to actually a qualified counselor. We want to get them to somebody who can actually help them of person to person interaction is necessary. And I think that's part of what I like about where I see AI going just in general, but particularly with Glue AI, is that it's not so AI dominant that we lose human to human contact. Like there is a real sense, the checkers example, I think is fantastic. There's a real sense in which, hey, why does a human need to be doing these things? They don't. Let's let the AI do those. Now we take a load off of the human. I see the same thing in education, right? We've all known that, that like one-on-one tutoring would be fantastic, but how do you get one-on-one tutoring happening? That's like a manpower issue. You just don't have the human resources to implement that. But with AI you can approximate it. You can recreate it. And so this is an area where we just don't physically have the capacity to do that. And we can use the technology to supplement. It's not replacing anyone. It's supplementing what's already going on as a human activity. Yeah. Oh man, I just, you say that and I think of like a personal example, right? So I don't know, maybe it was like fifth, sixth grade or something. It could have been later, but, um, you know, neither of my folks went to college, real young, moved a lot and they tried tremendously hard. So great folks, not perfect. And I was working on math homework once, I remember, and I remember my mom being really frustrated cause she like, it became apparent to her, she could not help me. And I just remember being like, dude, I, I can't help you. Like, I, I don't know. Right. And uh. And man, right. If I could have just talked to a ChatGPT, hey, this is my geometry problem and blah, blah, blah, blah. And okay, it'll talk to me like I'm talking to it and then, you know, it'll walk me through it. So yeah, I can only imagine brothers. It's, uh, yeah, I mean, I've been

So quickly and then walk with them as they did their work. It was really fantastic. So I think there are those applications that this is going to, it can be a huge help as opposed to us always thinking about it in terms of a gloom and doom mode. Let me ask you a serious question. If something triggered a major market drop in the coming months, would your retirement be ready or exposed? With inflation, market volatility, and ongoing global uncertainty, more families are taking a closer look at whether their retirement plan is truly built to hold up. And many are finding that adding a layer of protection makes a lot of sense. Sanctuary Metals is a Christian-owned company that helps families strengthen their retirement savings with physical gold and silver through a gold IRA. During uncertain times, many people look to precious metals as a way to add stability when other assets may be under pressure. If you'd like to explore whether a gold IRA is a good fit for your situation, Sanctuary Metals makes it easy to get started. Text GUIDE to 94878 to receive your free retirement defense guide, or call 888-958-6579 to speak with one of their knowledgeable team members. Again, text GUIDE to 94878, or call 888-958-6579. Yeah, I mean, think about your example, just apply to discipleship, right? And so we've talked to a lot of discipleship orgs, and I think, on one hand, this is not a shortcut. There's no, I have had spiritual development that God has given me that I don't think I would have had unless He gave me a desire to memorize a large portion of Scripture, for instance. Just, it almost reshapes my brain. Having said that, the harvest is plentiful and the workers are few. And so, if you've got someone that's a titan in business or whatever, and that's where God's called them, and they know some verses, and they could really start their own group, essentially, right? Be a lay leader in the church, but they just don't have the confidence to have every zinger question. This is, yeah, how do we equip that person to lead people to Jesus? Right, right. And I think it can happen through that AI. I think it's a really unique way for us to ask questions, to have a dialogue, not, you know, if you think about, man, I got to search through how many websites, and then I got to read all this information and still not answering the question I wanted to ask. You know, like the way we do it now is much more work-intensive on us. The AI actually is far less work-intensive, as long as we can begin to trust that the information it's providing us is good information, trustworthy information. And I think that's where you guys have really pushed this, where you've got the Christian AI piece. And so, I would say this is, there's so many applications for it that we're not even thinking of. And I think some of the early applications where I saw, you know, pastors using AI to preach their sermon or pastors, you know, and it's like, those are unfortunate because those probably aren't the best ways to use this. They just aren't. I think there's far stronger ways to use artificial intelligence that will allow us to preserve our human contact without, but while also sort of offloading some of those brain drain activities that often we, we don't really need to participate in. Yeah, a hundred percent, right? And whether they're brain drain, whether it's overtasking for an admissions assistant or an admissions director or the on-call pastor, you know, but it also creates new avenues. And give me an example. Sorry, that's my beeping. But I'll give you another example of a church using it to find a new avenue. So church 121 here in Dallas, Texas, Grapevine, they've got a passion for youth. And so they gave their FCA kids, turns out they had them in four high schools, these cards, little three by three, no bigger than the palm of your hand. And yeah, for those that are actually, I want to hear for those that are on, you know, watching something like this, not churchy at all. And it has things like, what is the purpose of life? Why did God make me this way? Why are so many Christians hypocrites, right? And they told their kids in FCA, go put these in locker rooms, cafeterias, and bulletins. And we're going to do it a week at a time. And if you look at the data and there's tons of data things we could talk about, this example is cool in that it, one, a lot of kids ask a lot of dumb stuff at school or in a time of school hours, like you would imagine, whatever, right? So try some of that. I can envision, yeah. Yes, right. However, if you start getting, because it's all a UTN, we segregate that data, a question at like 10 30 about, you know, my mom's yelling at me and I just can't stop my anxiety till the next day. Number one, that's not a question. That's more like a call for help. Number two, they could be asking ChatGPT that question or another, you know, friend, which might be great if they're a Christian, but they're asking the church essentially, right? And so they're, I don't wanna say they're entire, a lot of their 2025 ministry content is off the data from those cards. Okay. Yeah. Which is very cool. And we talked, maybe we should talk a little bit about this, is that AI isn't just a search engine. It's just not a way for us to get answers necessarily. It's actually generating data, I think is the way you put it. Oh yeah, yeah. And so let's talk a little bit about that just so people get a vision for that. This was one of those things that I think when we first started talking about artificial intelligence, I hadn't really thought of. Like it made sense once you explained to me, but I wasn't immediately thinking, oh, all this data is actually going into the system and now it can be collated and you almost have like a mini market research. I mean, 20 times better than Google analytics that you can see. So talk a little bit about that. Right on, thanks for pointing that out. That's cool. I wasn't sure if we'd get to it. So I'll give you just another story. KCBI is the largest Christian radio station or thereabouts in the country. Single station, not like a syndicate like K-Love or anything, but they're in North and Central Texas. And they have a lot of listeners. I listen, but their target listener, like a lot of churches have a target, you know, young family, whatever, is a mother, 45 to 68. That's who they're going for. And they content programming is for them. Having said that, they had our faith assistant for a year, pushed it on the air a few times. We integrated it even in their text messages, which was great because that's a whole different ball of wax when it comes to type of data. But when you ask the station manager, you know, what's one of the reasons that people join the community? They're really trying to bring people into community. And he says, well, for when our new donors are interviewed, they are like, why'd you donate? He says something is very common, which is, well, I was listening a few weeks ago. I was prayed for that thing. And you guys mentioned it on the air that day. God is using you to work in my life. I wanna be a part of what's going on here. And so, you know, normally, this was summertime. They're doing ads. It's listener. It's not ads. There's, you know, the pitches for donations kind of like, oh, this is listener supported KCBI. If God's using you, using us in your life, pray about it, join our community support, bring this to other people. Pretty standard. This year, I know they finished early and they finished over target. And I'd like to think part of the reason was because every now and then they did a lot of what they were doing, but they would be stuff like, are you a mom struggling with anxiety right now? Maybe there's a nagging guilt. Mom, this prayer is for you. Say this prayer with us. By the way, we have a fall fundraiser going on. And if you take, if we, you know, we have tons of graphs for all the data. If you take a, I mean, for shucks, for the folks that are watching, I'll just do a quick screen share, which is to say almost 70% of their non-administrative questions. Things like about Jesus played at nine or 10 yesterday. Almost 70% is anxiety, spiritual struggles, guilt, shame, stress, and relationship difficulties. And so if you actually click into spiritual struggles, it turns out on most of those three or four out of five have to do topics with assurance of salvation. So they take their data. It's the second biggest category, spiritual struggles. And they go, okay, they created an ebook called doubt. And it's been a phenomenally performing, you know, in the first six months of its circulation because, hey, we don't have this resource, but now we do. If you're struggling with this question, this is for you. And they're creating a community out of a radio station in 2025. Yeah, yeah. Fascinating stuff. Cause I mean that, that intelligence just, I think that was one of the things we, and I mean, I struggle with it on the podcast too. It's like, what do people want to hear? I know what I wanna talk about. You know, I know, I know the sort of guests I enjoy having on,

It's allowing you to listen to an audience that you couldn't otherwise listen to. And I think that that has to be that basis of developing that community. Radio has always been more of a one-way medium. Yes, there were call-in shows and those kind of things. But it's generally been a one-way medium, similar to what we're doing with podcasting. And so if you can get that ability to listen and actually create that, you know, building block of a community, I think that's pretty fantastic. Yeah, I said for a zinger title, every one-way piece of communication, AI transforms into a conversation. Yeah. And so, man, yeah, there's so many ways in which, like, I've looked through some of your guys' content prepping, like it, big fans. Yeah. I have not seen content because it's probably hard to get data now that I'm in a, you know, startup and glue mode. I work from home. Yeah, yeah. Things are way different with me and my wife and my kids now that I work from home. I need good, deep theological guidance on working from home. And there is a deficit of it. So bring me the rain. I'll have to try that. Yeah. I don't know that I've figured it all out yet either. I'm in my home office at the moment, and I'm always wondering whether people can hear my four-year-old upstairs, so. Well, I've got a four-year-old too, so you're even more equipped to talk about, like, I got like my floor before I get out of here to, like, shift mindsets. Otherwise, people get worse. It's a different beast, man. It's a different beast. Well, Chase, this is awesome. Hey, talk a little bit about how people can get in touch with Glue AI, you know, where they might find more information on it. Where would you route people? Yeah, so faithassistant.com is a way. They can go to glue.com, but faithassistant.com links directly to our AI team. You can see some of the ministries that have deployed solutions. You can even book time with me or one of my teammates there, and then we just kind of, we'll do everything from just, you know, meet you and show you a quick demo to, we've been doing half-day, full-day strategy sessions for the bigger ministries on, all right, what's a crawl, walk, run, fly AI plan look like for this seminary or this whatever. Sure. We are only focused on faith-based folks that are trying to love people and get them to Jesus. Very cool. Yeah, so if you're running a ministry, if you're running a church, if you're doing something like that, and you feel like maybe faith assistant Glue AI could actually help you out, I'll put the links in the show description, and so folks, you can just go there and check it out. Click the link. Maybe book some time with Chase or one of his colleagues there. We've been fantastically happy to have Faith Assistant on the Moody Center site. We've actually got bigger plans for it, so we're moving toward those. We implemented this to, you know, sort of, you know, we're in the walk stage, I think, if not the crawl stage, right? And we're just trying to figure out, okay, what does it really look like for us to maximize what this can do for us and for others at moodycenter.org? But it's been a great learning experience, and we're happy for the ride. Yeah, that's the real test. Go to moodycenter.org and ask, write a poem like Moody would about whatever topic and make it funny and rhyme. That's right. That's right. Yeah. Well, Chase, it's been awesome talking with you, man. I appreciate you being here. And thanks just for all the work you're doing with the, in the AI space. And thanks for explaining a little bit about the unique work, I think, that you all are doing with the Christian AI. That's really helpful. You have been very gracious, and I appreciate your thought leadership. Double vote for work from home material, but I appreciate you very much, Shane. Thank you. All right. Take care, man, and thanks, everybody, for being here. We'll catch you on the next episode of Thinking Christian. Just want to take a second to thank the team at Life Audio for their partnership with us on the Thinking Christian podcast. If you go to lifeaudio.com, you'll find dozens of other faith-centered podcasts in their network. They've got shows about prayer, Bible study, parenting, and more. Many of us feel hurried, and did you know that being in a hurry is costing us more than we realize? Hi, I'm Jem Fadling, co-host of Unhurried Living, where my husband, Alan, and I help people learn to live and lead from fullness rather than on empty. We provide resources and training to teach you healthy patterns for rest, work, and spiritual connection. With more than 25 years of experience at the intersection of spiritual formation and leadership development, Unhurried Living seeks to inspire others to rest deeper, live fuller, and lead better. Join us each week as we continue to have conversations about leadership, soul care, the power of prayer, and much more. You can find Unhurried Living at lifeaudio.com and on your favorite podcasting app.