Caring for Others in South Sudan: A Conversation about Grain for Pain

Hey everybody, welcome to this episode of Thinking Christian. I'm here with Aline Bransilva, who is the president of Grain for Pain. It's a nonprofit ministry that provides grain to South Sudan. And I've been friends with Aline for more than a decade now. And he's had this ministry going on for a long time. So today on Thinking Christian, we're going to be talking a little bit about his background, where he came from, what he's been doing, and also an awful lot about Grain for Pain. So Aline, welcome to the program, and tell us a little bit about yourself. Well, it's great to be with you. I'm very excited about that. I think I'm as a supporter of your, of Thinking Christian, as much as you are of Grain for Pain. You have been a donor. You've supported us from the beginning. Very, very thankful for your partnership. Yes. Yeah, absolutely. So this is the longest story, but it has to be said in very few words. I actually was born and grew up in Romania. And I grew up in what I think to be one of the worst periods of Romanian communism. So the years of 1988, 1989 is where the dictator of Romania went and visited a specific country, or maybe you've heard of it, North Korea, came back really inspired, and he wanted to replicate what's happening over there and really starve the people and created a, he wanted to pay off the, anyways. But there was like, families would grow up with half a bread a day per family with a card. You actually had to have a card and, you know, with a stamp, and they would give you half a bread a day per family. No electricity at night. Anyways, he really wanted to make sure that Romania becomes like this independent country, not connected to anybody and no debt, no nothing. Well, that ended up really poorly for the dictator, but what that gave me is that's basically the foundation of my life being really connected. And so I think for the rest of my life, I had this massive empathy for people that are going through these kind of challenges. So God completely changed my life in my first year of college. I went and did computer science. And for the next four years of my life, I worked with the Roma people, the gypsies and Roma. There's a difference between that. But the Roma kids, you know, countryside, all that, 70 kids, stayed with them, after school program, feeding and all that. So those are the small steps that I think led to what became one of the greatest investments of my life in the largest continent on the world, in the world, and the largest country on that continent, which used to be Sudan, which now is separate in South Sudan and Sudan. So that's kind of the fast forward of why I've always had this massive, massive soft spot for need for people that are going through significant challenges in the world. Yeah, and so talk a little bit about, you know, where did you go to college? You mentioned you went for computer science, but where were you when you did that? Was that in America? Was that in Romania? That was in Romania. So my undergraduate was in Romania, and I did computer science and marketing. A lot of Romanians, if you're listening to Thinking Christian, it's the first time you hear about Romania. I meet a lot of people and ask them where it's on the map, and they have a hard time with that. So it's Eastern Europe. Highly recommend visiting. By the way, it might be the only country that a lot of people speak English quite fluently, especially the new generation. So that's a good selling point for people. So I did my undergrad in Romania, and I did my master's program in the United States of America with the Union University in Intercultural Studies, Global Studies. And I loved that. I really, really loved the master's program. It was a great program with a specialty in ethnography and research. And that really also pushed me towards South Sudan. I had an unending passion for Africa, but I got a chance to do a research project in Africa on the effect of war on the concept of family and all that kind of stuff. Okay. And just to reinforce a little bit about what you're saying with Romania, I've been there twice. So I've been to Cluj, and I've been to Bucharest, and a little bit outside of Bucharest. And everybody I've met from Romania talks about Romania as sort of this, how would I say it? It's sort of the up and coming country in Eastern Europe, and particularly, I think, up and coming from a Christian perspective. And so can you comment on that just a little bit? Am I right in that perception, or how would you characterize it? You caught me in a good time because this morning I started my devotional with listening to the president of the research, the academic society in Romania talk about the fact that we speak very poorly about Romania, and we need to change that. So the reason they said that is before the end of communism, you know, right after the end of communism, the first thing they had to do is re-edit the history books because the history books that the communists wrote, we beat everybody. We won against the Ottoman Empire, everybody, but we never understood why we beat everybody and we're the ones paying taxes. It just never made sense that we beat them, but we were paying taxes. So they had to completely re-edit. So before the fall of communism, Romania was this shining. It was the best thing that ever happened in the world. We won every war, everything. After that, they edited it to kind of bring it down to some reality. But the next 30 years of post-communism, it was an identity crisis where people are really speaking poorly. We're the poorest, nobody is the worst we do. Until now, I think we're starting to balance of the fact that we have, it's a significant purpose. Romania has been around for just as a country for a hundred years, as a location, as a zone, as different parts of the Romania for 2000, more than 2000 years. And it provided my hometown is from the 1400s, which is really powerful if you think about like the history over there. So there's tremendous history with it. But besides just our history, where we come from, Romania is offering so much to the world. It's the startup hub of Europe. It had the European cultural, the capital of culture is in Romania twice. So it really is the startup country. It is the startup country. And the largest evangelical church in Spain is Romanian. The largest evangelical church in Italy is Romanian because a lot of Romanians have to go and find work when in that crisis, post-communism. And so they're coming back and even my home church sent missionaries. We have, I have friends that are missionaries in Mongolia, friends that are missionaries in Siberia, friends that are missionaries all over the world. So Romania, it really is a very passionate, passionate country for God. Very cool. Yeah, I've enjoyed visiting the two times I've been there and, and the folks I meet. I finally met somebody from, I was teaching a course in Czech Republic and one of the students was Romanian. And I think she may be the first person I've ever met from Romania who did not know you. Almost every Romanian I meet, I say, Hey, do you know Aline? And they almost always do. So this was the first person who didn't. And so she's, she's got a special place in my heart. Yes. Yes. So you really became, we'll get to grain for pain a little bit, but let's talk about your sort of educational journey because you did have this sort of opportunity to start researching this from an academic perspective. Yes. And talk a little bit about how that worked out and didn't work out for you and how you ended up sort of having to kind of shift and change as you pursued this passion for helping South Sudan. So this, this gives me a chance to, to introduce why South Sudan, why, you know, why, why this massive passion. And it's been since 2009 that I've been really deeply connected with this, with South Sudan and the, and the country of Sudan. But it was, it was a clear morning and I will never forget that morning where, and I was always cautious with this and I'm always caution. This is, I'm now sharing something sacred from my heart with you where I was having a devotional. I was in Romania working with the Roma children and God whispered in my ear, Africa. And I was, that's it. I started packing. I started preparing. It took eight years from the moment God said, you are going to work in Africa to actually fulfill that. And I got connected. A very close friend of mine, a missionary doctor worked with a missionary doctor from Austria that started a ministry in 2005 and called Miak Wadang. And Wadang, so in South Sudanese and the Dinka tribe, Miak Wadang means hope for tomorrow. And it's a powerful story because that was his nickname. So he was a medical doctor, moved to South Sudan before the 1980s. And 1985 is when the other, the civil, 1985 is when the other civil war started in the second civil war. Between 1950 and 2005, South Sudan only had 11 years of peace. That's it. And after that, so from 2005 to 2013, it was, it was the longest, the longest time, but that was actually, it was really, really controversial. You have the comprehensive peace agreement. And in 2011, they separated as two countries. So that was disruptive. And then 2013, a civil war starting in South Sudan. Anyways, there are

And that was the release. Finally, after 8 years of a promise, I get to go. And I'll never forget the moment I got to South Sudan, actually to Khartoum, to North Sudan. You couldn't fly directly to South Sudan. I flew into Khartoum, and I wanted... Let me ask you a serious question. If something triggered a major market drop in the coming months, would your retirement be ready or exposed? With inflation, market volatility, and ongoing global uncertainty, more families are taking a closer look at whether their retirement plan is truly built to hold up. And many are finding that adding a layer of protection makes a lot of sense. Sanctuary Metals is a Christian-owned company that helps families strengthen their retirement savings with physical gold and silver through a gold IRA. During uncertain times, many people look to precious metals as a way to add stability when other assets may be under pressure. If you'd like to explore whether a gold IRA is a good fit for your situation, Sanctuary Metals makes it easy to get started. Text GUIDE to 94878 to receive your free Retirement Defense Guide. Or call 888-958-6579 to speak with one of their knowledgeable team members. Again, text GUIDE to 94878 or call 888-958-6579. Kiss the ground because of the promise of being in a place where God said you're going to be there. And no need for that. There was a sandstorm. The ground kissed me. The ground kissed me everywhere. I think it was the worst sandstorm I've ever seen. And it was a big hug from the land to be like, welcome. So in 2009, I went for the first time. And in the first, the greatest need that there was there, I actually traveled. We traveled four days by car. We traveled ungodly amount of hours by boat to get to this place, Malakal. And I got a chance to spend just to stay under the tree with the elders to listen to the story, to connect with the people. And I knew that I will be connected to that place for the rest of my life. The greatest need, I will never forget, a parent came to me, a mother of a child. And first of all, I was the first white person to go there that was not a medical doctor. And Wadang means tomorrow. So hope for tomorrow, Mia Wadang. The nickname of the doctor was Wadang because every single time people saw him, they said, I'm going to see tomorrow. I'm now going to get a chance to see tomorrow because the doctor is here. And if anybody knows me, I'm not good with medical stuff. I am actually the opposite of, like one time when I had to get a shot, I think I saw my grandma and she passed away many years ago. It was, I'm just a dramatic person. And I was the first white person in that whole area that was not a medical doctor. And they would all come and show me their pains and their cuts and their disease and all this. And I needed a doctor. Then we realized, and the medical doctor I was with told him, like, we want to start education. This man is here just to see if we can do some education. And I'll never forget a mom, after they showed me all the cuts and all the bruises, a mom came and grabbed me by the shoulders and said, you need to help our kids get out of this predicament, this cycle of poverty, this cycle of things that they're doing. And that mom connected to me on a soul level as a parent myself to know that she looked me in the eye and said, you need to help us make sure that these kids have a different future. Now, I am very keenly aware, and I'll tell you why I'm keenly aware of all the history of colonization and all the breaking down of hurt that has happened there. I walk keenly aware of the history, of the broken history with that. And yet I still think it is a sacred calling to actually partner and collaborate with people on the ground in Africa and create opportunities for learning in partnership with them. Yeah. And so you're really, you know, Grain for Pain is obviously not an educational ministry, right? Grain for Pain is more of a humanitarian ministry, we could say. It's providing grain for people there on the ground in South Sudan. But you've done a lot of research on what it might look like to do education in this arena. And so what are some of the challenges of doing education? What are some of the challenges of actually achieving what that mother is asking you to achieve? Like, what does that look like? Great question. I do want to make the leap between our passion for education there and Grain for Pain. In 2010, so I started my involvement with Miakwadang as a member of Miakwadang in 2009. In 2010, I went back to South Sudan. And South Sudan and Sudan in general has two seasons. It has the rainy season and it has the drought season. Six months of the year it rains, six months of the year you have drought. It's common to the northern part of Africa, but South Sudan has some extremes in there. That year, they've had one full year of drought instead of having six months of rain. So you actually had, and I was in proximity to people that were actually dying of hunger. Not only did their crops die, but actually the grain that they used to plant for the next year. So you're not only having one year setback. If you're in a place that doesn't have any electricity, and the history of South Sudan, so North Sudan was colonized by the Turkish people. And South Sudan was colonized by the British. But by that point, the British Empire colonized, and Great Britain colonized so many countries that they didn't need South Sudan, even though it's very rich in resources. They had enough. So they colonized it, but they didn't build anything. So Kenya, for example, they built train tracks and roads. And all of a sudden you have development. If you have the train moving, if you have cars driving, South Sudan has no development, no infrastructure, no roads, no train tracks. So you still use the Nile for development, and they don't have major forests where you can actually cut trees and build homes. So it's still really, really underdeveloped. It's actually, at a certain point, it was the most underdeveloped country in the world with the massive richness of 400 dialects and tribes. So it's very diverse, but very underdeveloped. So that year they experienced an entire year of drought, and we have experienced, I actually sat close to villages and tribes that were actually starting to die of hunger, which is where we started Grain for Pain in 2010, a campaign of Miakwadang called Grain for Pain. It was actually for the pain that we are witnessing, clearly witnessing in front of our eyes of people dying of hunger. And so we decided, and that's why Grain for Pain stayed connected to that to say, it's a very simple and very clear ministry. It only provides grain for people that are in distress. So not for abundance. If you actually can get a garden of your own or if you can get started, we provide seeds. And from 2010, we provided grain. We stabilized seven tribes along the White Nile. We actually raised a significant amount of funds in 2010 as a campaign. From 2010 until 2013, we have done community development. We had three crops per year. We started a school. There were 220 children in the school. We really did partnership with the community to do micro-businesses, agriculture, engineers from all kinds of places coming and helping, wells, digging wells. And in 2013, the Civil War started. And so I also started a PhD on primary education in South Sudan. I could talk about that for hours and hours because it's fascinating to me because in South Sudan, United Nations dropped in there called Education for All, a campaign called Education for All, where they took primary education books and primary education from the United States of America and dumped it into South Sudan. The purpose of education is to actually ultimately create citizens and socialize people towards their culture. You go to kindergarten, you go to first grade, first grade to eighth grade to go to the high school, high school to go to college. If you take somebody's system of education and dump it in another country, you've de-socialized them. You've actually completely removed them from the heartbeat of their society. And my research focused on, it was action research, looking at a school of 200 children. What would it mean to develop what somebody developed later on, a concept of Ubuntu Goji? Instead of pedagogy, pedagogy, what does it mean to create education that keeps in mind the person next to me, that actually doesn't destroy the culture, these socializes, but acknowledges the cultural values of that society while still making them marketable? Their skills could still actually be marketable to the marketplace of the world. So they'd be competitors on the hiring market. That was the research. And then that research went away. In two weeks, I lost two, three years of work, almost three years of work, because the civil war destroyed the school. And it was just completely gone in absolutely two weeks. I'll never forget those two weeks. We're back on Thinking Christian. I'm Richard Beatty. And we are going to continue our conversation about Grain for Pain. Not only did their crops die, but actually the grain that they used to plant for the next year. So you're not only having one year setback. If you're in a place that doesn't have any electricity, and the history of South Sudan, so North Sudan was colonized by the Turkish people. And South Sudan was colonized by the British. But by that point, the British Empire colonized and Great Britain

electricity, and the history of South Sudan, so North Sudan was colonized by the Turkish people, and South Sudan was colonized by the British, but by that point, the British Empire colonized, and the Great Britain colonized so many countries that they didn't need South Sudan, even though it's very rich in resources. They had enough, so they colonized it, but they didn't build anything. So Kenya, for example, they built train tracks and roads, and all of a sudden you have development. If you have the train moving, if you have cars driving, South Sudan has no development, no infrastructure, no roads, no train tracks, so you still use the Nile for development, and they don't have major forests where you can actually cut trees and build homes. So it's still really, really underdeveloped. It's actually, at a certain point, it was the most underdeveloped country in the world, with a massive richness of 400 dialects and tribes. So it's very diverse, but very underdeveloped. So that year, they experienced an entire year of drought, and we have experienced, I actually sat close to villages and tribes that were actually starting to die of hunger. Which is where we started Grain for Pain in 2010, a campaign of Miakodang called Grain for Pain. It was actually for the pain that we are witnessing, clearly witnessing in front of our eyes, of people dying of hunger. And so we decided, and that's why Grain for Pain stayed connected to that to say, it's a very simple and very clear ministry. It only provides grain for people that are in distress. So not for abundance. If you actually can get a garden of your own, or if you can get started, we provide a seeds. And from 2010, we provided grain, we stabilized seven tribes along the White Nile. We actually raised a significant amount of funds in 2010 as a campaign. From 2010 until 2013, we have done community development. We had three crops per year. We started a school. There were 220 children in the school. We really did partnership with the communities to do micro-businesses, agriculture, engineers from all kinds of places coming and helping wells, digging wells. And in 2013, the civil war started. And so I also started a PhD on primary education in South Sudan. I could talk about that for hours and hours because it's fascinating to me because in South Sudan, United Nations dropped in there called Education for All, a campaign called Education for All, where they took primary education books and primary education from the United States of America and dumped it into South Sudan. The purpose of education is to actually ultimately create citizens and socialize people towards their culture. You go to kindergarten, you go to first grade, first grade, eighth grade to go to the high school, high school to go to college. If you take somebody's system of education and dump it in another country, you de-socialize them. You actually completely remove them from the heartbeat of their society. And my research focused on, it was action research, looking at a school of 200 children. What would it mean to develop what somebody developed later on, a concept of Ubuntu Goji? Instead of pedagogy, pedagogy, what does it mean to create education that keeps in mind the person next to me, that actually doesn't destroy the culture, these socializes, but acknowledges the cultural values of that society while still making them marketable? Their skills could still actually be marketable to the marketplace of the world. So they'd be competitors on the hiring market. That was the research. And then that research went away. In two weeks, I lost two, three years of work, almost three years of work because the civil war destroyed the school. And it was just completely gone in absolutely two weeks. I'll never forget those two weeks. It's a, yeah, I mean, I think, you know, in America, we deal with some of this stuff too, right? Not to the degree that you're talking about. But I think sometimes we forget that we deal with it. You know, that there are actual people, I remember living downtown Chicago, and part of what we were asked to do as parents was to put on fundraisers to help fill in gaps in public school education. And so we do that. And so there were still kids, even, you know, you know, my wife and I are fairly affluent. We've got, you know, plenty of money. Like we're fairly secure from an economic perspective. And so our kids were well taken care of and we could provide for them, but they went to school with kids whose parents couldn't do that. And so it was sort of an interesting eye-opening experience because I came from central Illinois where pretty much everybody was on the same playing field. I mean, it wasn't, there wasn't a lot of economic diversity that you're dealing with in central Illinois, at least from where I was at. And, you know, to move up to Chicago, you see this economic diversity where you've got kids who are literally dependent on the school to provide them breakfast. And so I think there's an interesting connection between what you've done with the education of the students, the Ubuntu Goji that you talk about, and the realities of just utter famine that are due to natural causes that obliterate a country's sustenance. And so it's really great to understand and just hear a little bit about how those two pieces, and I'm sure there's many other pieces that sort of fit together, but I mean, you know, grain for pain, it does address an ancillary issue to the education problem in South Sudan because if people are worried about where they're going to get their next meal, it's very difficult to do anything else. I mean, that sort of dominates your reality in ways that I think most people don't understand. I know I certainly don't have an experiential understanding of that. Yeah, and you're raising a great point because, for example, it's hard for us, and I live in America, I'm on the West Coast of the United States of America. I live in Portland, Oregon. Give a shout out to Portland. For whatever reason, it's getting a little bit rap in the news out there, but I want you to know that's only three miles downtown. This place is really beautiful. Come and visit. Please come and visit. It's a beautiful place. But immediately you are projected in a new reality when you see that grain is also currency. So parents would actually send the kids to school five, six hours away by boat because in their little village that is remote in the bushes, there's no school and there's a little larger area, so they would send their kids there and they would send them with a sack of grain. That's what they would use to pay for school. And also, I went to a school in 2019, right before the pandemic. We went to actually oversee the delivery of a grain because we've done it for now from 2013 all the way to 2019. I've never been in person to see. And Grain for Pain is actually really big on human dignity and making sure that we don't commercialize the people. Right now, if you go to Facebook.com for Grain for Pain, we just launched, we're doing a delivery for Thanksgiving and we're doing it. And I just posted some videos and some pictures of sacks of grain. No people, no children, trying to do all that. There are like thousands of sacks of grain and you get to see a little bit. So you know that we're doing it. But we're very big on human dignity. And when I went to their settlement camp, there was a school of 400 children and many would have come, but that's the only food they have. They can do one meal and if they don't have a meal, they can't come to the school. So it's very intricately connected between food, which is pure survival, really. There's no other discussion, and their education. So it gets really complex that it's not like, well, what's the big deal? You're just doing grain. When you're thinking that's the only grain they have access to. Right now, the 1.4 million refugees, they're less. They're starting to try to go back to South Sudan. Let's say there are a million refugees in South Sudan and Uganda from South Sudan. And the World Food Program gives and used to give. Now I'm hearing from the land it's even less. Six pounds of grain per family, six pounds of grain per family per six weeks. Six pounds of grain per family per family. So you can be two, three, five for six weeks. So then the grain discussion is becoming a little bit more complex. Yeah. No, it's really good to understand that context. I mean, I think, you know, again, it's just hard for us to bridge because we don't fully understand what you're working with over there. Right. What people are living with over there. And so the reality of it is that this grain is not just for food. It's also fueling everything that could produce some level of upward mobility. It's correct as well. It could get you out of. It's almost like the foundational building block of everything else that could happen in society. And it's just a really fascinating. It's a fascinating ministry. It's a fascinating culture that you're working in. And I think the interconnectivity of it is really important to emphasize because it isn't just about feeding people. Let me ask you a serious question. If something triggered a major market drop in the coming months, would your retirement be ready or exposed with inflation, market volatility and ongoing global uncertainty? More families are taking a closer look at whether their retirement plan is truly build.

to hold up, and then you're finding that adding a layer of protection makes a lot of sense. Sanctuary Metals is a Christian-owned company that helps families strengthen their retirement savings with physical gold and silver through a gold IRA. During uncertain times, many people look to precious metals as a way to add stability when other assets may be under pressure. If you'd like to explore whether a gold IRA is a good fit for your situation, Sanctuary Metals makes it easy to get started. Text guide to 94878 to receive your free Retirement Defense Guide, or call 888-958-6579 to speak with one of their knowledgeable team members. Again, text guide to 94878 or call 888-958-6579. It's about giving them an opportunity to feed themselves. It's about giving them an opportunity to build beyond where they are right now. I mean, so yeah, I mean, you know, you mentioned earlier, like, I've given to this ministry several times over the years, and I love it. I mean, last time I gave, it was like, you know, just $10 per bag of grain. And you have a very tangible, hey, I can buy three bags of grain for people. Right. And I kind of love that. It's a really wonderful model that you've set up. And I think it's just really important for people to understand that this grain is going to more than just filling stomachs. It is. And I want to encourage our audience, because every time we talk about human need and vulnerability, and there's a lot to pack with it. And I've learned so much through the years of, it could be, there's a book out called When Helping Hurts. And it's a very vulnerable space. You have to be so careful. And I've done my own share of mistakes, and I'm learning from it. One of the things that I've discovered that it was really heartbreaking for me, and then it was just a massive blessing, is that sometimes we think, how can we really help? Like I actually connected sometime, one time with a leader of a network of churches and all this. And I said, look, we're doing this project. Can you please help us? And he was like, what difference does it make? It's a bottomless sack, right? What difference does it make? This is a bottomless sack. They will always have need to have food. So what difference does it make? And you have a lingering question with that. And when I went in 2019, we went in a settlement camp. And you're sitting there, imagine being surrounded. One camp alone has 50, 60,000 people. I'm bringing 200,000 pounds of grain. That feeds, let's say, 15 to 20,000 people. I'm bringing that into place. Now we've prioritized women with children that don't have husbands, people that are sick, elderly, people that can't actually cannot make crops for themselves. And you're also thinking, why are they not making gardens? Well, Uganda is not a thriving country themselves. They're much better in different positions. They're not in a conflict or a war, but they don't have the land to give. So they give 50,000 people, they get the mountainous area. So these people are occupying mountainous area where they cannot fit. So we're there meeting with the elders. We're sitting under the tree, meeting with the elders. And I'm expecting them to say, I cannot believe that you brought us grain. This grain is this and this and this. I'm thinking our conversation is about the grain. And our conversation had very little to do with the grain. They stood up, by the way, they took meeting minutes. Just so you know, we're here, there's half of them dressed there. And somebody's taking meeting minutes, right? And they're saying, who are you from? Your position, your title. And it was in a circle talking. And somebody stood up and said, I am very thankful that you are here because that means we are not forgotten. You know, I could have walked in there with five pounds of grain in my pocket. It was not about the 200, 300,000 grain. It's the fact that we are now having a human moment. And they know that somebody from the west coast of America is thinking of this person. It's human dignity, the connection, the ability to... And that's why you're thinking, because you think you cannot make a major difference, maybe you don't want to do the $10. But I can tell you, in one sack of grain, it's packed hope, human dignity, a future, three months of living for somebody. And I believe, based on scriptural value and power of the truth, that I believe that something positive is more powerful than something negative. I think the only way to fight bullets and cannons and all that kind of stuff is with one sack of grain, with one act of goodness. Yeah. That's a really powerful story, man. I mean, you... I think it's easy to forget how much just recognizing humanity does for people. Yeah, not all of us have the resources to go in and just blow the doors off and give them everything that they could possibly ever want or need. But so much of it is just, hey, you're there. We remember. We care. We're part of the same world. We're part of the same creation. We're all God's creatures. Here's some grain. But just being grateful that they're there, being grateful that they're alive, recognizing them. And I appreciate the fact that you show them that dignity. I mean, I like the idea that you don't show a lot of pictures of the people on social media. It's always the grain. And so I'm sure that that is, in a lot of ways, a very difficult decision for Grain for Pain. Because it would be much easier to have a lot of faces on there. Well, that's where we'll have to take a break here on Thinking Christian. And then we'll be right back, and we'll hear more about the infrastructure problems and also the building problems in South Sudan. When we come back on Thinking Christian. Where can people go to maybe purchase a sack of grain for South Sudan? What's all your contact info? Yeah, and I'm so thankful for the opportunity. Every time I get a chance to speak about, and South Sudan is just this most fascinating place. And there's so many stories of faith coming out of that. It's actually mind-blowing. And I know that God is having his hand on this land. So having just a little corner of that and being part of that is just a wonderful experience. So people could go to grainforpain.com. I'm gonna say it slow. I want people to miss this. It's being used in different ways. Grainforpain.com. You can also go to facebook.com forward slash grainforpain. And on Facebook, we usually post updates of all the campaigns. And we have a thing now in the next three months or four months of our season. We had a few people out of the refugee camps that came out and said, I would like to say something to the people of the world. And we've done a few interviews. And they volunteered. They said, we would like to actually have this. And there's some discussions with some mothers and some people in the community and what that grain meant for them in that time and how it actually, and it's really powerful. Those are gonna be rolled on grainforpain.com, also on social media. So please find us. We're on most social media platforms. And it's easy as we use PayPal through the website. You can just give 98% of everything that is given to grain for pain goes to the land. That's important to say. We're a team of five volunteers in America and larger group of volunteers on the land in Uganda and South Sudan. And the reason I say 98% is because of the bank transfers and some of those fees. Now, if somebody from our audience wants to volunteer to cover those, then we're gonna be 100% of our proceeds go to this. But I think 98% is actually quite really good. Pretty solid, yeah. Because we don't have any overheads. We don't want to have overheads. Usually a website costs and all that. We cover them ourselves. But that's what happens with the funds that you give. Well, and you know, so Thinking Christian is a separate thing. So it's more something I do independently or through Useful to God. But DL Moody Center is sort of my day job. And so I'm president of the DL Moody Center. And this year, toward the end of the year, we're gonna be announcing a partnership with Grain for Pain. And so all the donations that come in, you know, from kind of Giving Tuesday onward, we're donating a portion of those proceeds back over to Grain for Pain and just trying to help out Aleem in this ministry and ultimately really just trying to advance God's kingdom through this humanitarian effort and really encouraging people to take some notice of a great ministry that gives 98% of its proceeds, which is kind of unbelievable, over to South Sudan. And so, yeah, excited to be partnering with you on the DL Moody Center side of this. And really excited to see what God does with it. Well, we're very thankful for that partnership. Very excited about this. Even just the fact that we get a chance to speak about the people in South Sudan and the people in Uganda. It's a massive opportunity for us. So thank you so much, James. Thank you so much, Moody Center and Useful to God. It's a massive opportunity. We love it. Yeah. Well, man, I appreciate you being on and just thanks for the conversation about Grain for Pain. Thanks for all you're doing there. And we'll close this one out. But Grain4pain.com.

Yes, yes. And so that's F-O-R, Grain for, F-O-R, pain.com or Facebook forward slash Grain for Pain. And, yep. And so I'm guessing if you just Google Grain for Pain, you will also find it. You will find it. So take a look at it. Be on the lookout. If you haven't signed up for Moody Center stuff, go over to moodycenter.org, sign up for our newsletter. You'll be able to connect with Grain for Pain there, and it'll also be in our show notes. And so you can take a look there and get connected to Grain for Pain. If this is something you're passionate about, this is something you're interested in as you look to give toward the end of the year and just really express your thankfulness to God by giving back. Grain for Pain is an excellent ministry to do that with, so I just encourage you all to do that. So thanks so much, everybody, for listening. Thanks, Haleen, for being here. And hit grainforpain.com and come back for the next episode of Thinking Christian. Thanks, everybody. Take care. Thanks for having me. I want to take just a second to thank the team at Life Audio for their partnership with us on the Thinking Christian podcast. If you go to lifeaudio.com, you will find dozens of other faith-centered podcasts in their network. They've got shows about prayer, Bible study, parenting, and more. Life Audio. Has fear stolen your peace? I'm Jennifer Slattery, lead host of the Faith Over Fear podcast, helping you fight your fears and grow your faith. Subscribe at lifeaudio.com.